Reaction on OBE survey #1, 40% has not projected

And I am one of them. This forum is primarily about OBE's right? (not counting kundalini since that counts as OBE accomplished)
Well in the poll CFtraveller held 40% answered NO, which means at least 35% of the 2500 registered users has NOT projected.
Why is this? What are your troubles? Can we make a tread with people's progress and troubles, and see if they have something in common? Since I think it's a little premature to make a new tread about everybody's problems which all seem the same.

For example, I have never projected, I don't dream lucid regularly (and it's not something I can control), I'm only trying. I woke up with vibrations a few times, but often I forget the experience (which could mean I have projected but not consciously), or fall asleep since I'm tired.

I feel a little down when I read all the succes stories of people, while a large part of the people visiting these forums never project (or do it consciously anyway).

Can you people out there who don't project share their (non)experiences? And can the people who are practiced projectors tell about when they first projected, or learned?
I think it would be helpful, or at least it will be a good read :lol:

Martin

I think that's a good idea, i haven't projected yet either, or i just don't remeber it.

JS

I think it's a good idea also- after enough people reply with their stories (like what they tried, how long, in what order, what their (if any) discipline was, I'll go ahead and re-post mine and I'm sure others will too.

Finally, a thread I can participate in!!

I've correctly attempted to AP for a week or two.

I learned NEW because before I didn't really think it was that important...

I was going pretty hardcore
1 hour of Physical Relaxation
1-3 hours just trying to stimulate my energy ways (Not even raising the energy)

I think trance is the part that takes me the longest because I hate the feeling of being in trance so I get a bit frustrated because of the feeling and I just go to sleep hoping to get a very vivid dream. Other times its because I take so long just trying to do physical relaxation it gives me the thought of "Just keep doing it you already spent 1 hour trying to physically relax" and then I get to stimulating my energy ways which I always think I'm doing wrong and that sometimes I might be mistakenly stimulating my primary circuits.

50% of the time I don't make it to raising energy for more than 2mins before going to sleep because I always have a feeling that I'm raising the energy arms part wrong and so I just raise with my legs, which gives me the impression that my lower body is WAY stronger than my upper body because I rarely stimulate my upper body as long as I do with my lower body...I also tend to stimulate my left side very well and basically do a lazy job of doing the same thing to the right leg.

I guess because I'm under the impression that I need ALOT of energy in order to project so I'm constantly just stimulating for hours because I need to be able to get more energy to pass through.

With all that said I think I attempted to astral project a few times...
- Twice I partially projected as my neck muscles were still tense (This is what caused me to start wanting to physically relax for 1-2 hours)
- Once I felt the heart center vibrations after rushing through the whole process because I seemed to be doing everything else for many hours and never trying to project. I got so surprised that I actually just spent maybe 10-20mins tops and was projecting, which I then snapped out of trance and messed everything up.

I stopped trying everything a few days later because I was spending about 14-16 hours a day in bed just trying to do this. In my head I'm thinking "There is no way robert bruce spends 3 hours just trying to prep for a projection." I'm always under the impression that I'm not doing the things right or I'm rushing it so I basically wrote out the process and how long it would take a night and it adds up to almost 5 hours. (I've never actually sat there and went through the whole 5 hours) This isn't counting going into trance or even trying to exit. This is just me focusing on getting physically relaxed, then trying to stimulate the energy ways, and then finally raising it...then go on to trying to project which I never get too because I just go to sleep.

Wow, you spend more than 10 hours trying to practice this? Including sleep? I always try to get into trance before I go to sleep, and so did I yesterday. Like yesterday. I laid still for 45 minutes, but then I got get bored. I'm waiting for something to happen. I think that expectation kills it.

But astral explorer, I think your practices will be rewarded greatly if you add some exausting exercises troughout the day like sport. I find it extremely hard to fall asleep if I stay in the house all day (which luckily doesn't happen that often).

I also heard that trying to project before going to sleep is like swimming upstream. I have tried setting my alarm clock in the middle of the night, but it's hard to find the motivation to just do it. I get around 7 hours sleep at night, and waking up 5 hours later to try to project will make me have a hard time getting out of bed later. And, I notice that my biggest REM period doesn't start after 4,5 hours like some suggest, but rather after 6 hours, which at an ordinairy night leaves me with only 1 hour practice time before having to get up. I don't think I'm alone in this. A lot of people should have a hard time practicing during the working week right?

My comments to what I've seen so far:

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Originally Posted by Astral Explorer

I've correctly attempted to AP for a week or two.

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That's not even close to feeling frustrated. The MAP program, for example, tells you you can expect to project in three months. So you're already feeling frustrated even though you haven't been doing it long enough. This is negative programming you're instilling in yourself.

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I learned NEW because before I didn't really think it was that important...

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Ok...

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I was going pretty hardcore
1 hour of Physical Relaxation
1-3 hours just trying to stimulate my energy ways (Not even raising the energy)

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Nothing wrong with this, except the order in which you're doing this. You shouldn't do NEW right before a projection attempt- you should take about 1/2 to 1 hour a day (not even that much, I'm just trying to 'cover the bases') during the day when you're up and about because it energizes you. Doing it right before the attempt results in what you are doing- winding yourself up to then try to unwind yourself up. That's wasted time.
Instead, as part as your normal physical exercise, do NEW. Then go about your day.

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I think trance is the part that takes me the longest because I hate the feeling of being in trance so I get a bit frustrated because of the feeling and I just go to sleep hoping to get a very vivid dream. Other times its because I take so long just trying to do physical relaxation it gives me the thought of "Just keep doing it you already spent 1 hour trying to physically relax" and then I get to stimulating my energy ways which I always think I'm doing wrong and that sometimes I might be mistakenly stimulating my primary circuits.

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If you do this at the projection attempt it won't take you so long to get to trance. There are definite relaxation exercises to do, to keep your mind occupied, instead of just 'waiting' for something to happen. Then after relaxing, raise energy. The full body circuit doesn't involve the arms at all so I'm not sure what the next thing you're talking about is about. But raise energy with the full body circuit, and then go on to trance exercises. Once again, there are specific trance exercises, to keep you from getting bored. Do these, and if you're still too awake, there are more mind-occupying exercises to do while your body goes to sleep.

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50% of the time I don't make it to raising energy for more than 2mins before going to sleep because I always have a feeling that I'm raising the energy arms part wrong and so I just raise with my legs, which gives me the impression that my lower body is WAY stronger than my upper body because I rarely stimulate my upper body as long as I do with my lower body...I also tend to stimulate my left side very well and basically do a lazy job of doing the same thing to the right leg.

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Raising energy is about directing the energy to your lower tantien or subnavel circuit. That's it. It stimulates your chakras, but that's about it. Other NEW exercises (sponging, energy ball, etc.) are for stimulating all circuits, but that's not what you're supposed to be doing at this point. You want to raise it for projection.

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I guess because I'm under the impression that I need ALOT of energy in order to project so I'm constantly just stimulating for hours because I need to be able to get more energy to pass through.

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You project every night without doing anything. You need energy to stay aware and remember your projection. You need energy to 'go with' your energy body when it goes. But you don't need it to create the energy body or to launch it.

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With all that said I think I attempted to astral project a few times...
- Twice I partially projected as my neck muscles were still tense (This is what caused me to start wanting to physically relax for 1-2 hours)
- Once I felt the heart center vibrations after rushing through the whole process because I seemed to be doing everything else for many hours and never trying to project. I got so surprised that I actually just spent maybe 10-20mins tops and was projecting, which I then snapped out of trance and messed everything up.

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If what you said in the beginning is true, then you're not doing so bad. A partial projection after two weeks is excellent. Don't get discouraged. And if there's something about NEW you're confused about, please ask questions in the Energy Work section, we're here to help.

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I stopped trying everything a few days later because I was spending about 14-16 hours a day in bed just trying to do this. In my head I'm thinking "There is no way robert bruce spends 3 hours just trying to prep for a projection."

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The thing is that when you first start energy work you're supposed to be very thorough in moving energy in every detail of your body. But after some time, after your energy body is 'trained' to respond to your thought-stimulation, just a few swipes here and there will do the trick. But you have to put in the time at first. So, he doesn't spend that much time, but he's very experienced. When he was beginning? I'm sure it was a lot longer.

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I'm always under the impression that I'm not doing the things right or I'm rushing it so I basically wrote out the process and how long it would take a night and it adds up to almost 5 hours. (I've never actually sat there and went through the whole 5 hours) This isn't counting going into trance or even trying to exit. This is just me focusing on getting physically relaxed, then trying to stimulate the energy ways, and then finally raising it...then go on to trying to project which I never get too because I just go to sleep.

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Do me a favor: Rewrite your routine in order in detail and I'll take a look at it and then I'll give you an alternative routine, "If you want to try it", of course.

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Originally Posted by Martin

Wow, you spend more than 10 hours trying to practice this? Including sleep? I always try to get into trance before I go to sleep, and so did I yesterday. Like yesterday. I laid still for 45 minutes, but then I got get bored. I'm waiting for something to happen. I think that expectation kills it.

But astral explorer, I think your practices will be rewarded greatly if you add some exausting exercises troughout the day like sport. I find it extremely hard to fall asleep if I stay in the house all day (which luckily doesn't happen that often).

I also heard that trying to project before going to sleep is like swimming upstream. I have tried setting my alarm clock in the middle of the night, but it's hard to find the motivation to just do it. I get around 7 hours sleep at night, and waking up 5 hours later to try to project will make me have a hard time getting out of bed later. And, I notice that my biggest REM period doesn't start after 4,5 hours like some suggest, but rather after 6 hours, which at an ordinairy night leaves me with only 1 hour practice time before having to get up. I don't think I'm alone in this. A lot of people should have a hard time practicing during the working week right?

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Have you tried getting up 2-3 hours (as opposed to the middle of the night) and going straight to trance? It's what works for me best, when I do it.
And yes, I usually try to project from Friday to sat. mornings, because I can go back to sleep after writing my notes down.

Ok thanks for the replies CF, they were really helpful since I practice NEW almost every day before bedtime :lol: No wonder I can't relax. I use it to clear my mind, I automatically begin to draw energy to my limbs when I try to clear my mind. Anyway, off to a new tryout tonight.

I'll post something funny that happened yesterday. I kind of dozed off in bed and had a short dream about some people, and a girl. We were laying down and before I knew it she kissed me. I opened my eyes and was like WTF? It felt so real. I could swear I just felt my lips touching hers. I think I can call that 'progress' :D

Better get used to that kind of thing. I'm just saying.

Lol.

I just want to say this because this is a thread to help people project.

When being new to this stuff, i think we try to overdue it. So next time your trying to fall into a trance or clear your mind, try not to try so hard. Next time you are trying to fall into a trance stop and think about what you're doing. Then try to do it more gently. This is the problem i when i started trying to induce a trance, and this method helped me.


But heres my schedule

Im following MAP in 90 days. So i just follow along with that.

I too have trouble balancing this with school and work. So mon-thur i just follw the MAP's schedule. Then while lying down before bed i'll raise some energy. Hoping this ill make my dreams more vivid.

During everyday though even at work i'll do some energy raising here and there.

On fri-sun at around 8 or 9 ill follw the MAP's schedule for that day. Right after i put my self in a trance (which i'm getting much better at). Then i try to project(this may be my problem?)

I fail and then go to sleep that night hoping to go lucid or a WILD.

JS

I replied to this earlier but had computer problems so here it is again (not as good as the first one)

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On fri-sun at around 8 or 9 ill follw the MAP's schedule for that day. Right after i put my self in a trance (which i'm getting much better at). Then i try to project(this may be my problem?)

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Following MAP is good. Are you tired on a Friday night? Or are you wide awake?

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I fail and then go to sleep that night hoping to go lucid or a WILD.

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How far do you get? Do you get hallucinations, sounds, etc? Or do you just fall asleep?

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JSHope for the best, but plan for the worst...
JoSac

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How about Know You Will Succeed, if not today then tomorrow?
More questions: Are you doing the MAP book course, or the MAP CD course? If #1, are you using the BWGen? If #2 are you supplementing the course with affirmations and such? And, how far are you in it?

If you have already answered this in a previous thread, remember I am old and senile and forget things from thread to thread. :? :?: :)

No im usually wide awake at that time, thought right now im tried lol. and its about 1020 fri night. ( i lost my car so i can't go anywhere for a couple months, very boring).

I usually end the course then put my self in a trance. It varies but ill usually be able to raise some vibrations. I have not heard astral noise yet tho. But you know how and image burns into your eyes. Its like that but swirling all round and forming shapes and stuff. And i don't fall asleep right after this, i usually read AD.

My sig i put in there because i am currently in the process of going to court where im facing a 2 year imprisonment . But im using the book. I use the BWGen on and off, if i feel like it, but i like doing the work without and aid. I actually don't do the affirmations bc of my schedule. Are they really helpful, if u think they are i will start doing them again. And im about to go into week 6 tomorrow.

Thanks JS

Coming back to my brain, I think you mentioned somewhere else about the possibility of doing time- about that I recommend you start using affirmations: "Divine Order". I feel that your desire to improve your life and circumstances will help you there, and yes, I believe in affirmations as long as they're part of a more extensive plan. Now back to the AP thing:

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I usually end the course then put my self in a trance. It varies but ill usually be able to raise some vibrations. I have not heard astral noise yet tho. But you know how and image burns into your eyes. Its like that but swirling all round and forming shapes and stuff. And i don't fall asleep right after this, i usually read AD.

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Why do you stop, if you wake after and read? I think you should continue on the trance until a-Your hypnagogics slow down for you to engage them and phase, if separating is hard for you-
b- You get exit sensations and separate- now, I read you do get the vibes, but can't quit after that, because exit happens often minutes after vibrations, and sometimes they don't come at all.
c- if you get vibes and they stop, and you can't separate, go to energy body loosening methods before trying an exit technique, and if you partially get out, use an exit method that doesn't return your attention to your body. A common mistake for people is to use exit techniques that use body awareness after they have separated, which returns them.
Try to not get frustrated- a 'foiled exit' is not the end- if you're in trance and get out, it's easier to get back to trance from the 'foiled exit' than from 'scratch', that is, fully awake. So consider your goal, at least at first, not to do a complete and full exit, but to get to the point where you can get to the 'almost exit', go back in body, and go back to the exit stage again. This may help get the 'startle' effect out of the way.
BTW, I do believe that if you're not getting auditory hallucinations, be it a pop, buzz or anything else, you're not deep enough in trance.
Consider (just for this exercise) deep trance the experience of being completely asleep and dreaming and aware, and able to manipulate yourself out of your body. If you can move, if you can hear sounds that are environmental (such as the tick-tocking of a clock, etc.) your trance is not deep enough.
I hope this helps some.

About the popping and buzzing. When I'm doing energy work, and when I've raised a lot it seems that my furniture and tv are king of cracking. The same sound you get when wood stretches or shrinks dude to temperature changes. Do you think this is energy related? I certainly produce massive amounts of heat when doing energy work.

This happens a lot when we meditate, not only when we do energy work. I think there's a thread called "Things that go bump in your head" somewhere around here. I think this is more common than people realize. Just the other night my son (naively) told me he was wondering what was up with his room, because pretty much every night just as he was going to sleep something would creak, pop or snap, and not in his head (I've explained about hypnagogics in a general sense), and he wondered if things 'know' that you're going to sleep and decide to make noise. I laugh because of the frequency that this theme pops up in these metaphysical forums.
No answer, just more questions.
(no pun intended)

Hmm in pretty ceartin i haven't said that before, idk how you would have known.

a-Idk why i end the trance, but what is phasing, im going to look in the ADpedia after i post this.
b-Ya i usually go a couple minutes after to see what happens, i started doin this once i learned about it from one of your older threads.
c-thats what usually happens, they just stop, i use the water ski tech, so i don't think it will return me to my body.

Im going to try the almost exit thing tonight, but after a few times and if it feels right ill go for the big 'it'.

I do usually hear a pop that will come from mykeybord or my xbox 360 that i normally don't hear at regular times. But im going to try going deeper.

Definetly helped
Thanks JS

Same here JoSac. I can hear practically everything cracking and popping. I guess it's just hypnagogics. But now what I really wanted to know is:

Why are you doing this? Why are you trying to project?

The people who are projecting can reply as well of course, but I want to know why people want this in the first place. What is driving them?

I personally first wanted to have something to do during the night. I often get the feeling the day's aren't long enough. And if I can live on during the night that would really extend my time I have on this earth.
And also, I can't stand the fact that there is more out there, and I know nothing about it. All these stories. It's not hard te live in ignorance, but it is when you know you do. The first step is knowing there is more, then explore. (Or so I thought anyway)

So, let's hear some opinions...

I like what you said so ill add that to my list.

But its actually a long story how i got into this which makes me think it was for a ceartin reason, it all stems back to me getting arrested (but thats a story for a later time). So i really don't know why i go into it, but now i want to project and travel out to galaxies. R.B. sadi sometimes he travels out to a distant galaxy and sit out there and meditates.

Space and paranormal stuff have always amazed me. But i plan to practice this for the remainder of my life. I want to travel to the higher astral dimensions.
Idk if you have read what they are like but the sound very appeasing.

JS

We need to get some more people on this thread lol its just me martin and CF.

JS

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Originally Posted by JoSac

We need to get some more people on this thread lol its just me martin and CF.

JS

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It's that codependency thing. :lol:

Well then...

I picked up MAP after waking up from a dream to spontaneous vibrations. I'd heard of it all before (from when I lurked at Psipog in college), but I figured that was a sign it was time to get into it myself. That was in October, and I haven't gotten anywhere near that close since. I followed the book diligently for a little under two weeks until I found myself stuck on the very very basics, made a thread about it, and was advised to relax and go at my own pace. This turned into a longer break than I expected... 2+ months of nothing to write home about.

...Until last week when I got one of Aunt Clair's readings and she swore, despite the fact that I was fully normal-mode conscious at the time and knew nothing about it, she saw me project on command. Anyone know what to do with that information? - 'cause I don't.

How did she know it was you, and for that case where you are.

AuntClaire is very spiritual it seems, and if this was to be said by one person, i would think it her.

Ask her about it, if true, then you know you have the ability and you have done it before. It's probably just shadow memory recall problems your having then.

Kepp a dream journal if your already not. Theyre fun to lok back at like a montth ago and be like, OH ya i remember that.

JS

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Originally Posted by anotherone

Well then...

I picked up MAP after waking up from a dream to spontaneous vibrations. I'd heard of it all before (from when I lurked at Psipog in college), but I figured that was a sign it was time to get into it myself. That was in October, and I haven't gotten anywhere near that close since. I followed the book diligently for a little under two weeks until I found myself stuck on the very very basics, made a thread about it, and was advised to relax and go at my own pace. This turned into a longer break than I expected... 2+ months of nothing to write home about.

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Could you point me to your original post, please?

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Originally Posted by JoSac

How did she know it was you, and for that case where you are.

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Well, she did describe me physically. Not many details, but the ones she went for were right.

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AuntClaire is very spiritual it seems, and if this was to be said by one person, i would think it her.

Ask her about it, if true, then you know you have the ability and you have done it before. It's probably just shadow memory recall problems your having then.

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Yeah, you know me.... well, you don't know me, but I like to downplay everything. :P But I thought the shadow memory thing only kicked in if you were asleep or whatever?

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Kepp a dream journal if your already not. Theyre fun to lok back at like a montth ago and be like, OH ya i remember that.

JS

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I am. :D I don't really look back at it, but it is there. I draw, like, floorplans of where I was and everything.

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Originally Posted by CFTraveler

Could you point me to your original post, please?

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Oh snap, I'm gettin' called out. :shock: I knew I shoulda checked to see what people actually said before I wrote that!

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=10326

Okay, so... bad memory on my part. Maybe that was later? Maybe nobody ever actually said that to me? http://www.dragonspyrit.com/gaiaanim..._sweatdrop.gif

No shadow memory does not only occur while you are sleeping.


I just finished AD!!!!

JS

Hooray!

...I think we killed the thread, though...

Okay, I know you're all having fun in the Life Plan thread, but... hello? http://www.dragonspyrit.com/gaiaanim.../icon_gonk.gif

Yeah he's right! We need some stories, not view of people on life! ;) (Goes on a giant PR tour to promote his tread)

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Originally Posted by Martin

Yeah he's right! We need some stories, not view of people on life! ;) (Goes on a giant PR tour to promote his tread)

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Stories about what?

About people struggeling to project, so we might see a pattern. I think that half of the people browsing this forums does not project consciously. Anyway, I'll just wait

I have a nonscientific explanation for that- if you see the memberlist it's much larger than the people that post here on a given 2-3 month period, and have seen the survey. It seems to me that most people that come in here do so because they read Robert's book and have questions, (that is, are starting to either get interested in AP or have been doing it and want to gain more mastery of it). Those that do and get what they need eventually move on to other things, or become moderators if they want to continue studying the subject. So you will always get a larger percentage of people that are starting out-Just take a look at the new member thread- Probably it's another survey we should try.
Did that make sense? I'm not feeling coherent this morning.

Interestingly, I ran a very informal survey at the coffee room at my church and about half the little old ladies that go to my church admitted to having OBEs. So 40% may be a good percentage overall.

The problem with us is our problems just aren't interesting...

Thats the point of making just one tread. You don't have to make a new one for all your little problems, just post them here!

I did. That problem is: nothing's happening.

Believe me, the stuff I'm complaining about is not just a misperception I have. I am not "being too hard on myself." I can objectively state that I'm not developing any powers, or gaining any control, or having any experiences that I didn't have before. The reading I mentioned, I asked for because I was discouraged, and I wondered if my experience was really normal and temporary, or if something might actually be keeping me from having success, that needed to be broken down by someone else. When I finally got it, just being on the other end of her connection for a few minutes was more effective than everything I've been trying to do for myself for months-- which seemed to confirm my suspicion. The positive things she told me about my development I couldn't relate to at all, to the point where, like JoSac, I wondered if she had the right person. If she did, it was some superior version of me that I have absolutely no connection to, and not the me that actually needed looking at.

I guess I'm starting to sound ungrateful... I just don't know what to do with myself. I don't like not being able to trade stories with everyone about my experiences or my latest incredible vision. I feel shut out, and powerless to do anything about it. I truly don't know if there's any point to me continuing to practice on my own like normal. But the alternative?-- who's going to have that kind of time for me?

Send me a pm and we'll work this out. Even though I suppose that some people can't do certain things (like my mom can't sing and there's no amount of lessons that'll give her the ear for it) I think you can do something. I really can see that you want to do this very badly and feel compelled to try to help you in any way I can, if you'll let me.

Oh, I'll let you. :D

(...Glad I didn't post the MORE melodramatic version!)

Wow, how did I forget about this...great feedback

Question...If I wake up in the middle of the night would I already be physically relaxed despite not doing physical relaxation exercise before going to bed?

Her is my exact routine...haven't tried in maybe 3-4 days

Physical Relaxation - Tense and hold each body part for 1 min...move neck forward and down on chest for 3 mins, move neck backwards and down on neck for 3 mins. I do this 2 times.

Energy Works - Stimulate toes, sole, leg pathway, hands, palms, arms...24 bounces on legs, then spine, then arms...full body circuit 2mins (This is where I usually stop)

Trance - Falling sensation, if I feel I'm in trance I try body loosening and then I try projecting by rocket flying me out of space or climbing ladder (I did the ladder one when I was in a dream and started climbing a ladder, I was also waking up in my dream but still was doing the action which cause a projection which I got surprised and messed it up)

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Originally Posted by CFTraveler

My comments to what I've seen so far:

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Originally Posted by Astral Explorer

I've correctly attempted to AP for a week or two.

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That's not even close to feeling frustrated. The MAP program, for example, tells you you can expect to project in three months. So you're already feeling frustrated even though you haven't been doing it long enough. This is negative programming you're instilling in yourself.

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...this is good to know because I wasn't too sure how long it would take to start projecting...I personally had it set that I'd be doing NEW for the rest of me life, heck I'm dedicated to astral projecting for the rest of my life.

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Originally Posted by CFTraveler

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I was going pretty hardcore
1 hour of Physical Relaxation
1-3 hours just trying to stimulate my energy ways (Not even raising the energy)

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Nothing wrong with this, except the order in which you're doing this. You shouldn't do NEW right before a projection attempt- you should take about 1/2 to 1 hour a day (not even that much, I'm just trying to 'cover the bases') during the day when you're up and about because it energizes you. Doing it right before the attempt results in what you are doing- winding yourself up to then try to unwind yourself up. That's wasted time.
Instead, as part as your normal physical exercise, do NEW. Then go about your day.

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Yep I'll start doing that

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I think trance is the part that takes me the longest because I hate the feeling of being in trance so I get a bit frustrated because of the feeling and I just go to sleep hoping to get a very vivid dream. Other times its because I take so long just trying to do physical relaxation it gives me the thought of "Just keep doing it you already spent 1 hour trying to physically relax" and then I get to stimulating my energy ways which I always think I'm doing wrong and that sometimes I might be mistakenly stimulating my primary circuits.

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If you do this at the projection attempt it won't take you so long to get to trance. There are definite relaxation exercises to do, to keep your mind occupied, instead of just 'waiting' for something to happen. Then after relaxing, raise energy. The full body circuit doesn't involve the arms at all so I'm not sure what the next thing you're talking about is about. But raise energy with the full body circuit, and then go on to trance exercises. Once again, there are specific trance exercises, to keep you from getting bored. Do these, and if you're still too awake, there are more mind-occupying exercises to do while your body goes to sleep.[/quote]

will try...

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50% of the time I don't make it to raising energy for more than 2mins before going to sleep because I always have a feeling that I'm raising the energy arms part wrong and so I just raise with my legs, which gives me the impression that my lower body is WAY stronger than my upper body because I rarely stimulate my upper body as long as I do with my lower body...I also tend to stimulate my left side very well and basically do a lazy job of doing the same thing to the right leg.

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Raising energy is about directing the energy to your lower tantien or subnavel circuit. That's it. It stimulates your chakras, but that's about it. Other NEW exercises (sponging, energy ball, etc.) are for stimulating all circuits, but that's not what you're supposed to be doing at this point. You want to raise it for projection.[/quote]

I raise my energy to the subnavel circuit only, I thought you had to raise energy through your arms too...so I was trying to do my arms too. Even though I do it ok it is much easier just raising from my legs...I just had the interpretation that maybe my arms would be weaker than everywhere else.

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I guess because I'm under the impression that I need ALOT of energy in order to project so I'm constantly just stimulating for hours because I need to be able to get more energy to pass through.

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You project every night without doing anything. You need energy to stay aware and remember your projection. You need energy to 'go with' your energy body when it goes. But you don't need it to create the energy body or to launch it.[/quote]

oooo lol, I'm surprised I didn't figure this out by common sense lol. No wonder my dreams are WAY more vivid ever sense I started learning this, now I get it fully.

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With all that said I think I attempted to astral project a few times...
- Twice I partially projected as my neck muscles were still tense (This is what caused me to start wanting to physically relax for 1-2 hours)
- Once I felt the heart center vibrations after rushing through the whole process because I seemed to be doing everything else for many hours and never trying to project. I got so surprised that I actually just spent maybe 10-20mins tops and was projecting, which I then snapped out of trance and messed everything up.

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If what you said in the beginning is true, then you're not doing so bad. A partial projection after two weeks is excellent. Don't get discouraged. And if there's something about NEW you're confused about, please ask questions in the Energy Work section, we're here to help.

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I stopped trying everything a few days later because I was spending about 14-16 hours a day in bed just trying to do this. In my head I'm thinking "There is no way robert bruce spends 3 hours just trying to prep for a projection."

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The thing is that when you first start energy work you're supposed to be very thorough in moving energy in every detail of your body. But after some time, after your energy body is 'trained' to respond to your thought-stimulation, just a few swipes here and there will do the trick. But you have to put in the time at first. So, he doesn't spend that much time, but he's very experienced. When he was beginning? I'm sure it was a lot longer.[/quote]

Currently my energy body gets stimulated in about 20 seconds as my stimulation has got pretty good

Anyway thx for the feedback this was very helpful

I hate to keep talking on this subject but i thought this pretty important, im just looking for some input.

Fri. night me and a bunch of my friends went out to eat at Chilies, i was drinking before and while we were there. When we left we dropped off one kid, then went back to out home city. I was asking to drive all night (even though i was drinking, i knew i shouldn't, but i figure im a good drunk driver :lol: ) So i drove to another kids house so they could grab 'some stuff'. Next i decided to drive us to our city's woods (which is amazing i might add). We were sitting in the parking lot with lights on and some deer were frozen because of it, so we were observeing them from in the car. Next thing a cop car pulls in. Im just like you have to be kidding me. Its a fri. night with a bunch of kids in the car, im driving under the influence, and theyre doing w.e. in the back.

Idk why, but the cop just shined his light on us, i put up my hand and backed up and drove out of there and we didn't get stopped. I was SO scared.

I somehow think it was a message, or maybe the deer were sent there on purpose, to make the cop think we were just looking at them.

I take this as a message sent by someone higher. Im just looking for some input on wht you guys think...

Thanks JS

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Originally Posted by JoSac

I was asking to drive all night (even though i was drinking, i knew i shouldn't, but i figure im a good drunk driver :lol: )

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I got your input right here:

:shock: :shock: :shock:
:shock: :shock: :shock:
:shock: :shock: :shock:

Besides Don't drink and drive, what input did you expect?
Please don't do things like that!
BTW there is no such thing as being a good drunk driver. Too many people die because they think that way.

Progress this morning! I kind of had my first 10 second WILD (or how the guys would call it at dreamviews) I fell asleep at a normal time and directly entered a kind of lucid state. It only lasted for about 10 seconds though. Really cool, gives me good feelings about the future! I just felt like sharing. :D

Yaaaaay Martin! :D

Well what i was looking for is to see if someone thought those deer could have been there on purpose. Idk thats just what i thought, but it could have been a coincidence.

But i know DUI is a foolish thing to do.

JS

Seems that no one is on this thread no more. But i'd just like to update.

Im no longer using MAP. i dropped out i guess u could say.

My new routione is one day energy work the next meditation and trance work. I will still however us the new tech's from Map as i progress on my energy work.

JS