Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
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Originally Posted by CFTraveler
The only time I have a discernible body is when I etheric project (as in OBE)
By "etheric project (as in OBE)" do you mean what Robert Bruce calls a "real-time projection"? In which you're projecting into a space that's more or less like the physical world?
I know that I've had real-time projections in which I appeared to be only an invisible point of awareness.
Would you say this is a recent development? Or have projections always been like this for you? Did you have more of a discernible body in your earlier experiences?
I've certainly had the experience too of movement being a matter of will instead of body. Sometimes my projected double seems paralyzed... I haven't kept track, but I wonder if my double has been paralyzed only during the projections in which my physical body underwent significant, deep sleep paralysis. But, then again, there have been projections during which my body felt heavy and stiff and I had no trouble "swimming" out with my double (having a lot of mobility). And times where my double felt paralyzed in the same position as my body until I was able to move a certain distance away. During those times, willed movement worked better for me than "swimming" or flying away from my body.
Edit: I should add that those experiences were all etheric, or real-time projection experiences.
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamosis
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFTraveler
The only time I have a discernible body is when I etheric project (as in OBE)
By "etheric project (as in OBE)" do you mean what Robert Bruce calls a "real-time projection"? In which you're projecting into a space that's more or less like the physical world?
Yep.
Quote:
Would you say this is a recent development?
No, I would say it's been like this:
When I first remember having an OBE (the first one I realized what was happening, at around eightish) I had an etheric body, and going through a wall was a very intense experience.
After that, most of the etheric projections (aka RTZ) for years, I don't remember noticing a body. I don't know if I had one, but I didn't pay attention to it, because my focus was on the adventure of it, on the "where next?" of it.
As an adult, I remember having an etheric projection in which I had no body, in which I felt I was a point of awareness. It's one of those verified ones, so I call it an RTZ projection.
After I learned to project consciously, I saw my energetic hands, (etheric hands) and became aware of having an etheric body, and things like going through a wall or a mirror became deliberate ones, and the awareness of the body was part of the adventure.
When I phase or project to the astral from the RTZ, I don't have the awareness of having a projected vehicle, although this is not a given- I find that even though I may be in an astral locale I may have a body, I just don't have the awareness of one. Sometimes, the body becomes a symbolic vehicle, so that there is some sort of body awareness, it's just not a human body awareness. It's hard to explain.
So, I think the awareness of a body may have to do with the specific area of the astral or etheric you may be in- not so much on the type of exit you have, especially if you transition from one environment to another.
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFTraveler
So, I think the awareness of a body may have to do with the specific area of the astral or etheric you may be in- not so much on the type of exit you have, especially if you transition from one environment to another.
Hmmm. What do you think might account for the difference between RTZ projections with body awareness and RTZ projections without body awareness?
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
Possibly the reason or content of or for the projection. I've had RTZ projections that were mostly mental in content, (that is, there was a lesson to be learned from it that was fairly abstract) and the lesson did not involve having a body, while most of the projections that involve a fear content feature the body- so it may not be just about the reason for the projection, but the level of awareness at the time of the projection.
Of course, this is just supposin' on my part.
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
I've read that the type of double formed depends somewhat, or all, on expectation. I wonder, though, if the type of double formed has something to do with the "position" of the attention at the moment of projection. That is, if the attention is concentrated in the formless essence of being, your double might tend to be formless. If the attention is somewhere in the energy body...
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
Possibly, but on the first projection I had there were no expectations, since I was basically motivated by my desire to be somewhere else, and I didn't quite understand what had happened, and I had an energy body. Later on (after 2005) yes- I can say that I was more aware of an energy body because I had read I was supposed to have one- but before then it hadn't been even part of my thinking.
So I think the reasons may be so many that they can't really be classified individually- something more like in QM where you look at statistical trends instead of making a rule based on individual experiences.
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFTraveler
So I think the reasons may be so many that they can't really be classified individually- something more like in QM where you look at statistical trends instead of making a rule based on individual experiences.
Definitely.
The first spontaneous projection I had as an adult (I was half-in, half-out), I experienced myself as having an energy body.
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
I just wondered if the "bodiless" projections could be so-called mental body projections as opposed to etheric double or astral body projections. (?)
I guess it doesn't really matter what it's called...
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamosis
I just wondered if the "bodiless" projections could be so-called mental body projections as opposed to etheric double or astral body projections. (?)
I guess it doesn't really matter what it's called...
I believe so, maybe. :D
Re: OBEs with the Body Awake?
I'm suffering from an information bias with this thread. That is, I'm seeking information that may not necessarily help me to act.