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sono
25th June 2009, 08:27 AM
Does anyone else find this plan very disturbing?

http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... on-2009-06 (http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=nasas-mission-to-bomb-the-moon-2009-06)

Surely there are easier ways to search for water? I have a "bad feeling" about this date !

Beekeeper
25th June 2009, 10:29 AM
Maybe there will be some extraterrestrial interference.

I do wonder what gives them the right.

Neil Templar
25th June 2009, 11:50 AM
that's ridiculous, can't they drill to find out what's below the surface?
i hope there is some extraterrestrial interference.
Mika Bara talks about the true nature and origins of NASA here - http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members/mbara.htm
very interesting, and a little worrying in light of this news.. :|

Mystikal
25th June 2009, 12:47 PM
Sheesh, did someone declare the moon sacrosanct when I wasn't looking? Your collective dismay is ridiculous.

In case any of you haven't noticed, there are quite a few craters on the moon already, most of them formed by impacts far larger than that of a single rocket booster. Somehow, I don't think she'll mind one more tiny impact.

Or would you prefer if we never did anything, lest we impose our will on some part of nature? After all, what gives us the right? Maybe we should just sit around and think about better ways (which are likely nonexistant, impossible with current technology, or not actually better), while praying for something "higher" to come along and shame the unenlightened folk who dare to take actions which might have some impact (pun not intended)?

Xanth
25th June 2009, 01:17 PM
I don't think we have to worry...
Because the first step required is to get a frickin shuttle off the ground, and so far, due to hydrogen leaks which they can't seem to fix, they're failing miserable. LOL

So for now, the moon is probably safe... lol

EDIT: Oh, it's already up? Hmmm... oh well. Bye bye moon! :D

ButterflyWoman
25th June 2009, 01:23 PM
Your collective dismay is ridiculous.
Perhaps, instead of calling people ridiculous, you might find a more constructive way to express your opinion?

Mystikal
25th June 2009, 02:19 PM
I didn't call anyone ridiculous, nor do I think anyone here is ridiculous - I called their dismay ridiculous. There's a pretty big difference there.

Throughout history, people have sought to control other people. One of the primary patterns used to create this control is that of declaring something forbidden. This pattern manifests in many ways, from churches declaring sexual desire taboo, to governments enforcing a veneer of patriotism, to schoolchildren believing that they shouldn't correct a teacher who is mistaken. I fail to see how an attitude of "we shouldn't dare to kick up a dust cloud on the moon!" is anything more than one more manifestation of this pattern.

As such, it does not deserve constructive confrontation. It is a blockage in the collective human consciousness, and it should be destroyed. At the very least, I am not willing to be subject to it.

However, I expect what you really want is not that I should be constructive per se, but that I should be more polite. More distant, speaking with words that are less blunt. That's reasonable; not everyone responds well to bluntness. When pressured too hard about some element of their consciousness, people tend to paper over it rather than excise it, even if it's something they don't really want. People typically require a certain amount of space in order to examine and modify themselves.

I am not in the business of providing such space. I will not prevent people from seeking it out, I will not hound them if they don't wish to speak with me, I won't even mind too much if they misread my words as personal attacks in order to have a justification to distance themselves - but I will not temper my words merely because some people find them overly sharp. I do not want to live in a world of padded thoughts and indistinct words.

ButterflyWoman
25th June 2009, 02:39 PM
I didn't call anyone ridiculous, nor do I think anyone here is ridiculous - I called their dismay ridiculous. There's a pretty big difference there.
Right. So it's only people's feelings/opinions that are ridiculous. Got it.


However, I expect what you really want is not that I should be constructive per se, but that I should be more polite. More distant, speaking with words that are less blunt. That's reasonable; not everyone responds well to bluntness. When pressured too hard about some element of their consciousness, people tend to paper over it rather than excise it, even if it's something they don't really want. People typically require a certain amount of space in order to examine and modify themselves.
Well, yes, if you prefer, polite. I don't really care what your opinion of the moon is, nor what other peoples' opinions are. But there's no need to be condescending. For example, I'm pretty sure that everyone in this thread HAS, in fact, noticed that the moon already has craters.


I am not in the business of providing such space. I will not prevent people from seeking it out, I will not hound them if they don't wish to speak with me, I won't even mind too much if they misread my words as personal attacks in order to have a justification to distance themselves - but I will not temper my words merely because some people find them overly sharp. I do not want to live in a world of padded thoughts and indistinct words.
Fine, whatever. You could try reading the guidelines for posting again, then, and if you have a complaint, you're free to take it up with the administration.

viewtopic.php?t=186 (http://forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?t=186)

There's the link if you need it.

Neil Templar
25th June 2009, 03:58 PM
my dismay comes from the perspective that NASA apparently has it's own agenda, one hidden from public view.(take a look at that link i posted, above)
when i hear they're bombing the moon i don't automatically trust the stated reasons for their doing so.
as i said, if they must find out what lies beneath the surface, can they not drill?
why the need to fire missiles at it? is there something there they want to destroy?...

Xanth
25th June 2009, 04:14 PM
my dismay comes from the perspective that NASA apparently has it's own agenda, one hidden from public view.(take a look at that link i posted, above)
when i hear they're bombing the moon i don't automatically trust the stated reasons for their doing so.
as i said, if they must find out what lies beneath the surface, can they not drill?
why the need to fire missiles at it? is there something there they want to destroy?...
Well, the stated reason is to study the "dust" that gets expelled... they want to see if it contains ice and/or water.
This does make sense... so I have little reason to not believe that that is a least a PARTIAL reason for the bombing.
Blasting a bomb off from orbit would definitely be cheaper than sending a manned mission to the Moon... something that really hasn't been done for a very long time.

However, as you said, there have always been 'strange' things with Nasa. So one can never really tell.

CFTraveler
25th June 2009, 04:16 PM
Well, this could also be a 'test' to see if there is ET interference- I suggest that if there is such a 'program' we'll know, this wouldn't be a thing they can hide from the public, it seems to me.

Mystikal
25th June 2009, 05:07 PM
as i said, if they must find out what lies beneath the surface, can they not drill?

You are seriously underestimating the difficulty of building a spacecraft capable of doing significant extraterrestrial excavation. Furthermore, why shouldn't we go kick up a dust cloud, given that the result will be pretty similar to drilling, just a bit messier? Do you just not like the word "missile"? Do you disapprove of us spreading dust around the dust-covered lunar surface? Have you already decided that NASA is covertly malicious and disapprove of everything they do for that reason alone?


Well, this could also be a 'test' to see if there is ET interference

Why would they interfere? They haven't interfered with any of our previous spacecraft crashes. Granted, those weren't intentional, but I doubt they'd let us crash unintentionally while not allowing us to crash intentionally.

Blaze
25th June 2009, 06:12 PM
I agree with Mystikal on most points. The moon is used to be being hit; it won't mind being hit again.

Quite frankly, if the word "bomb" was never used, no one would care.

CFTraveler
25th June 2009, 06:27 PM
as i said, if they must find out what lies beneath the surface, can they not drill?

You are seriously underestimating the difficulty of building a spacecraft capable of doing significant extraterrestrial excavation. Furthermore, why shouldn't we go kick up a dust cloud, given that the result will be pretty similar to drilling, just a bit messier? Do you just not like the word "missile"? Do you disapprove of us spreading dust around the dust-covered lunar surface? Have you already decided that NASA is covertly malicious and disapprove of everything they do for that reason alone? Mystikal, even though you have a right to your opinion, please stop trying to provoke an argument. The words "do you just not like the word 'missile'?" is personal and provocative. Stop it. This is your second warning.
Admin.

Fish
25th June 2009, 07:29 PM
NASA is an arm of our government, therefore you WILL be kept in the dark about everything they ever do and discover - just like the rest of our government operations pretty much. Again our opinion about their actions doesn't matter only our conformity and tax dollars do.

Mystikal
25th June 2009, 07:37 PM
*sigh*

Let me rephrase that, then: "Among other possibilities, I suspect that your disapproval of this mission may be rooted solely in your subconscious reaction to the loaded language which the article uses to describe the mission, namely, its calling a spent rocket booster a 'missile' and describing the action of this inert object impacting the moon's surface as 'to bomb'." Is that better?

Jaco
25th June 2009, 09:49 PM
What's the fuss about, the projectile is not even nuclear. It will make a small hole, stir up some sand and that’s it.
You know that there's about 70 human made objects and crafts on the moon already?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_artificial_objects_on_the_Moon
Oh yeah, on June 10th this year SELENE space craft crashed as planned into the moon surface. The moon still exists :shock:, who knew...

CFTraveler
25th June 2009, 10:04 PM
*sigh*

Let me rephrase that, then: "Among other possibilities, I suspect that your disapproval of this mission may be rooted solely in your subconscious reaction to the loaded language which the article uses to describe the mission, namely, its calling a spent rocket booster a 'missile' and describing the action of this inert object impacting the moon's surface as 'to bomb'." Is that better? Much. Thanks.
:wink:

CFTraveler
25th June 2009, 10:06 PM
What's the fuss about, the projectile is not even nuclear. It will make a small hole, stir up some sand and that’s it.
You know that there's about 70 human made objects and crafts on the moon already?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_artificial_objects_on_the_Moon
Oh yeah, on June 10th this year SELENE space craft crashed as planned into the moon surface. The moon still exists :shock:, who knew... *Sigh*

Neil Templar
25th June 2009, 11:00 PM
there's no fuss.
maybe the thought of them bombing the moon just doesn't sit right with me. i get it, it's covered in impact craters. it's not gonna do it any harm.
maybe i've been taking in too much conspiracy theory nonsense lately.
or maybe it feels like this "heavenly body" that has so captured the imagination of humanity throughout the ages should be treated differently.
yeah i know, romantic notions.

but like Fish said, none of us have a clue what NASA are up to, and it doesn't feel right to me.
is that okay with you Mystikal? :roll:

Neil Templar
26th June 2009, 10:47 AM
hehe, funnily enough i dreamed about 12 shuttles being sent up to destroy some invisible force that had been detected on the moon this morning.
the whole moon was engulfed in flame.
it looked like the scene at the end of Return of the Jedi, when they destroy the deathstar, and you see it from Endor, in the daytime sky. :shock: :lol:

Beekeeper
26th June 2009, 10:57 AM
Here is my main objection (and I'm sure it'll stir up a reaction) but who decided the moon belonged to the US? Does being able to do something because of technology automatically give America the right? Presumably there's a bigger plan and it potentially involves the rest of humanity. Is Obama the President of Earth now? Funny, I don't remember electing him. Imperialistic presumption?

Xanth
26th June 2009, 01:26 PM
Actually, nobody is allowed to "own" the moon.
It's legally in that area in which nobody is allowed that right.

CFTraveler
26th June 2009, 01:55 PM
I remembered reading an article (in a paper magazine just about that. Amazingly, I found it. Here it is: http://www.popularmechanics.com/science ... 64325.html (http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/air_space/4264325.html)
Apparently, many people already "own" parcels of it, although the legality is dubious.
It's one of those things.
http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/fragend/confused-smiley-013.gif

Neil Templar
26th June 2009, 03:02 PM
yeah. i can imagine it...
"hey! you f*ckers just bombed my bit of the moon!"
"oops! sorry. did you have plans for it?"
"well... erm, :oops: not really..." ..."why did i spend that money on a bit of the moon?"

"cos you're an idiot! and we've got your money!"

ButterflyWoman
6th July 2010, 03:11 PM
And to revive a very tired and somewhat contentious thread, I wanted to post this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Csj7vMKy4EI

That's from sometime in the mid-to-late 90s, but when I saw it today it reminded me of this thread.

Neil Templar
6th July 2010, 04:10 PM
hey, what ever happened there anyway?
what was the result of the action? was there any gain to be had?
was it a big old waste of taxpayers money?
did some secret alien base get blown up? :wink: :P

ButterflyWoman
6th July 2010, 04:50 PM
Hell, Neil, what do you care? It's just the stupid moon! Sheesh. :roll: