How do you know you're not lucid dreaming?

[outofbodydude]

Hi,
If you are not lucid dreaming, you will project knowingly. You will consciously leave your body as a fact.
Grant

With respect, I don't think you understood what this thread is about. If there is logic behind your statement, I think it was lost in translation.

[heliac]

But the question is, HOW do you know this? How can you be certain that you are not simply lucid dreaming and what you believe is the real time zone is actually a more or less stable dream environment like that of a lucid dream? How can you be certain that the environment exists independent of your mind and is not simply a subconscious creation?

It may be that we can't really know for sure, but i'm leaning more towards OBE being a form of lucid dream as you have already said. Seems to me OBEs occur in your mind just like dreams do. Sure we can have OBEs that feel like it's something more than a lucid dream and for some people that is enough to believe that an OBE is literally an example of consciousness existing outside of the body.

How you explain the OBE will depend on how you interpret it. So if you want to know more about how to explain OBEs you will need to ask yourself lots of questions that will allow you to look at how you think and how your thoughts and feelings inform your beliefs. Are your own and others personal experience or testimony enough to convince you? How do you value experience as evidence to whatever claims about OBE you are thinking about?

[outofbodydude]

It may be that we can't really know for sure, but i'm leaning more towards OBE being a form of lucid dream as you have already said. Seems to me OBEs occur in your mind just like dreams do. Sure we can have OBEs that feel like it's something more than a lucid dream and for some people that is enough to believe that an OBE is literally an example of consciousness existing outside of the body.

How you explain the OBE will depend on how you interpret it. So if you want to know more about how to explain OBEs you will need to ask yourself lots of questions that will allow you to look at how you think and how your thoughts and feelings inform your beliefs. Are your own and others personal experience or testimony enough to convince you? How do you value experience as evidence to whatever claims about OBE you are thinking about?

Good points, I agree.

Regarding seeing OBEs as a type of dream experience, this may be true, although it may also be true that dreams are actually a type of OBE.

[Sinera]

Good points, I agree.

Regarding seeing OBEs as a type of dream experience, this may be true, although it may also be true that dreams are actually a type of OBE.

that's my take on it, all you experience is "REAL", be it what we call a dream (lucid or not) or this 'waking' state, because the mind's "EXPERIENCE" is real, always, there's never any 'un_real' experience

[GRANT]

If you did not consciously exit your body; then your lucid. There is no question when you have a conscious exit.
Grant

[outofbodydude]

If you did not consciously exit your body; then your lucid. There is no question when you have a conscious exit.
Grant

Lucid simply means clear perception. There are enough similarities between OBEs and lucid dreams to warrant raising the question. Whether one is open and honest enough to explore the answer without bias or preconceived beliefs interfering is another story.