Homosexuality- Gift or 'Spiritual Handicap?'

[Ouroboros]

I agree completely with what Oliver said. As long as you're comfortable with yourself, that's the most important thing. Don't let others try to put a wedge into your soul by telling you that you need to conform to a certain standard to enter Heaven. You're God! Maybe their heaven sucks anyways, so make your own!

[Psychonaut1984]

Wow, thank you for these responses and pointing that out.

I flop back and forth with my beliefs as far as this topic goes, sometimes its really hard for me to tell when I am being true to myself or if it is my ego talking because, honestly neither side feels right to me sometimes, and sometimes I think I would be better off obstaining from sex completely. This is a perfectly acceptable decision in many spiritual practices but I feel like I am doing this partly out of fear and guilt, and that is the part that doesn't sit right with me. I feel like that means that I didn't learn my lesson or trascend the problem.

I mean maybe I am just being a cry baby and that is really the only way to evolve from the situation I am in now, but how would I be expected to know this? I am not hurting anyone. It seems like from day one most of this confusion is what has been causing the hurt, because it is going against what in my reality feels normal, not the 'problem' in question.

[Korpo]

Well, what you feel about the problem is a wholly different matter. Those are valid concerns you have to work through, and there are no quick answers. Just don't get confused by the "spiritual" opinions of that ilk you mentioned. You'll find *your* answer in time.

It might indeed take time, but as long as you're honest with yourself, and willing to face guilt and fear in order to overcome them, it will be all for the best, whatever the outcome. There's no spiritual disadvantage for any sexual orientation, I'm sure.

Take care,
Oliver

[Underdog]

Homosexuality is deviant behavior and should be avoided at all costs. Things will work much smoother when you go with the spiritual traffic, and not the wrong way on a one way street.

Sorry to be the bad guy; just trying to help.

UD

[CFTraveler]

Homosexuality is deviant behavior and should be avoided at all costs. Things will work much smoother when you go with the spiritual traffic, and not the wrong way on a one way street.

Sorry to be the bad guy; just trying to help.

UD

Homosexuality is behavior inherrent in any species that uses sexual reproduction. It is present in all animals that have sexual reproduction. So to say that it is deviant is not to know what deviant means.
And not, I don't believe you are trying to help- not even a little bit.

[ButterflyWoman]

Homosexuality is deviant behavior and should be avoided at all costs.

So, how does one "avoid" being homosexual? It's easy enough to become celibate (well, it's easy in theory), but the basic attraction is always going to be there. If someone told me to stop being attracted to men, I can tell you right now, it wouldn't work. I am now and have always been attracted to men. Since the body I currently inhabit happens to be female, that's socially acceptable, but if I'd been born into a male body, I'd be considered, by some people, to be some sort of deviant.

Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense. The physical body and the material world are illusion, and Spirit is not about physical gender.

[Psychonaut1984]

Homosexuality is deviant behavior and should be avoided at all costs.

So, how does one "avoid" being homosexual? It's easy enough to become celibate (well, it's easy in theory), but the basic attraction is always going to be there. If someone told me to stop being attracted to men, I can tell you right now, it wouldn't work. I am now and have always been attracted to men. Since the body I currently inhabit happens to be female, that's socially acceptable, but if I'd been born into a male body, I'd be considered, by some people, to be some sort of deviant.

Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense. The physical body and the material world are illusion, and Spirit is not about physical gender.

This is basically what I am talking about... It doesn't really make sense to me either. That's my whole conflict, if it is wrong, how am I supposed to know that by going with 'my nature' it would keep me from progressing spiritually in this lifetime. Then does that mean that in my following lifetimes I will continue being gay possibly spiraling downward in the process, lowering my vibration, drifting farther and farther away from 'God', until I learn to transcend it?

I am open to both sides but if being gay is a symptom of the soul punishing itself, how can expressing true love in a way that comes naturally, not necessarily lustfully, be the one thing that might keep you from evolving? So basically until you learn this lesson you might have to keep repeating lifetimes until you become a celibate holy person.

I've been spending all day thinking about this but its starting to give me a headache. I'm really trying to examine both sides in the hopes that the truth will sink in with me. The problem is that I agree with both sides.

[ButterflyWoman]

Then does that mean that in my following lifetimes I will continue being gay possibly spiraling downward in the process, lowering my vibration, drifting farther and farther away from 'God', until I learn to transcend it?

I suggest you direct this question directly to The Source of All Things. I'm completely serious. Ask, with an honest heart, and you'll get your answer. You don't have to take it on any earthly authority. Get it from the Source. (It WILL come to you if you ask. Really.)

So basically until you learn this lesson you might have to keep repeating lifetimes until you become a celibate holy person.

Being a celibate holy person doesn't fix anything, either. I won't go into all of my other life memories, but trust me, celibacy and/or holy vocation don't release you from any sort of cycles of karma or whatever you want to call it.

The problem is that I agree with both sides.

Just ask the Source of All That Is. Ask for clarity, and you will receive it. It may not come in a big rush of enlightenment or anything, but you will.

I'm sorry about your headache. Sending some healing, loving energy your way, and my sincere blessings. May you receive and accept the clarity you seek. And so it is.

[Korpo]

I am open to both sides but if being gay is a symptom of the soul punishing itself,

No soul punishes itself. While I have read, the real sins (like murder) have definitely be made up to the other soul you harmed, punishment itself goes against the very idea of the soul trying to evolve.

If you really are worried about the kind of comment Underdog has made, you must be very insecure about this.

how can expressing true love in a way that comes naturally, not necessarily lustfully, be the one thing that might keep you from evolving?

Who said you are disallowed lust? You're sticking to extremes here. True love evolves. It grows. Many relationships start very lustful and then become lasting companionships. True love and lust do not exclude each other. The only thing I warned about was lust being the only motivation - a person who's just out to "score" and has no regard for actually looking for a relationship. That is totally selfish.

So basically until you learn this lesson you might have to keep repeating lifetimes until you become a celibate holy person.

And what if celibacy isn't required and a false goal? For some, celibacy can ease attaining clarity. For others it is just a heavy burden. Everybody has to find out for themselves if they can live like that without distorting what they are.

I've been spending all day thinking about this but its starting to give me a headache. I'm really trying to examine both sides in the hopes that the truth will sink in with me. The problem is that I agree with both sides.

I know the feeling. I had the choice between love and what at that time appeared - on the surface! - right. It was a hard choice, and I chose love. I never ever regret it. What had appeared right, never was. One cannot sacrifice oneself to another person, or try to eradicate one's real needs. That's never in the interest of the soul.

The ideas that float around in your reasoning - that we evolve to be celibate, that the soul punishes itself or is punished, or that lust itself is sinful - need inspection. I don't think they're very sound, but only you can find out if they make sense for you in the long run. They sound a lot like guilt-inducing beliefs to me, like from a religious background?

Oliver

[CFTraveler]

Homosexuality is deviant behavior and should be avoided at all costs.

So, how does one "avoid" being homosexual? It's easy enough to become celibate (well, it's easy in theory), but the basic attraction is always going to be there. If someone told me to stop being attracted to men, I can tell you right now, it wouldn't work. I am now and have always been attracted to men. Since the body I currently inhabit happens to be female, that's socially acceptable, but if I'd been born into a male body, I'd be considered, by some people, to be some sort of deviant.

Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense. The physical body and the material world are illusion, and Spirit is not about physical gender.

This is basically what I am talking about... It doesn't really make sense to me either. That's my whole conflict, if it is wrong, how am I supposed to know that by going with 'my nature' it would keep me from progressing spiritually in this lifetime. Then does that mean that in my following lifetimes I will continue being gay possibly spiraling downward in the process, lowering my vibration, drifting farther and farther away from 'God', until I learn to transcend it?

I am open to both sides but if being gay is a symptom of the soul punishing itself, how can expressing true love in a way that comes naturally, not necessarily lustfully, be the one thing that might keep you from evolving? So basically until you learn this lesson you might have to keep repeating lifetimes until you become a celibate holy person.

I've been spending all day thinking about this but its starting to give me a headache. I'm really trying to examine both sides in the hopes that the truth will sink in with me. The problem is that I agree with both sides.

I have an idea where these ideas came from but if I talk about directly I will probably offend some.
Let's see how I can do it indirectly- Ok.....
Let's say that there is a religion (or three) that at some point needed slaves (monks) who work for them with no expectation, just for the joy of giving to the organization. They decide to declare sexuality as 'wrong' or 'sinful' or 'wasted energy' or 'of a lower vibration'. There is no inherent truth in these statements- it is simply a manipulation to make a certain type of person, one with a low sex drive for example- to look at service to the institution as a feasible way of life. Some (not many) decide to transcend their 'mundane' life and are steered away from sexual life so they can channel it as work. This is good for some people- that is, some people's natures tend to thrive in this setup.
But let's say, that most people don't, because the human need to be with each other (because that is how God made us) eventually wins out and a large percentage leave their life of service to fulfill other needs- the need for love, companionship, family, and sex. All normal parts of life.
But let's say that there is a smaller group (say, 10% of men, slightly larger percentage of women) that have sexual lives that are not sanctioned (that is, to have babies), and that the larger society does not value (always a mistake for many reasons, but that's another theme)- who better to emotionally traumatize and blackmail into service but the gay? And if you keep a tight control on this aspect of sexuality, then you have a steady supply of monks (i.e. slaves) that on the outside seem to be sexless, but actually aren't. You got yourself a win-win situation there.
But what happens if homosexuality begins to be seen as a natural part of- well, nature? What happens if sex begins to be seen as it is- as an aspect of life that is not only for reproduction, but for expression, even social control (certain animals use sexuality to control the pack, etc.)? What if homosexuals begin to be seen just as the same as the rest of us, deserving of just being who they are?
Well, there goes the steady supply of free labor-I mean 'dedicated service'. Mmmmm, what to do?