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Thread: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

  1. #11
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    Damn, never had that!

    Oliver

  2. #12
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    Modified it as follows - put the carrier pitch down to 80Hz. Tested that yesterday, worked - put me to sleep, woke up refreshed and felt like "clean." Just well-rested.

    Today I used the 80Hz carrier pitch, but instead of the "Stay at Delta 2.5Hz" I used the "Stay at Delta 1.5Hz". Also I used breath meditation to stay focussed - bringing the mind back from mental chatter again and again. That made me stay awake the whole session.

    The drops in the ramp and from the 2.5Hz of the "Down to Delta" to the 1.5Hz "Stay at Delta" are quite noticeable. I could feel the quality of mind change as the tracks were moving down through the stages. Towards the end I felt barely awake, and more adrift.

    One major problem is that my ability to focus on my breath decreases a fair deal after 20 minutes in general. I guess doing this more regularly will help with that. Dropping down through the states there were differing distractions - in the beginnigs it was mainly mental chatter. At some point also the "feeling" of images or barely visible images came up. I think this was at Theta stage, as I had this effect before. In the Delta stage the distraction was more like the incoherence in thought I get before falling asleep, when the mind seems to start to ramble and fade away.

    As for the general impression of the Holosync effect intended in this session... At several points I felt warm sensations related to blocks I have. I felt the blocks, but in a warm (but not comfortable) way. Whether this means resolution was taking place is hard to say.

    While the tape helped me enter different states along the wake/sleep spectrum, I somehow doubt Centerpointe's claim that this is supposed to be meditation. It is more like trance. My ability to focus or stay focussed or to stay with my chosen meditation object (onepointedness) did not improve by the tape itself IMO. Outside distractions lessened, I could in fact observe a sudden drop of outside sensory input, but the churnings of my mind did not change that much. When they did change it was down in the Delta range and I was also barely able to concentrate anymore. Probably I was close to falling asleep, and nothing else.

    The other claimed effect, that the sounds trigger purification and energy cleanup in the system, yes, that might indeed be the case from what I have "seen" so far. I guess that is what happens more strongly if you are awake at the Delta (or even Sub-Delta? What is the .5Hz and .3Hz range?) states. Of course it is far too early to tell anything conclusive.

    All of that under the assumption that Deeper Than A Zen Monk recreates the Holosync tapes faithfully. I do think so, for my taste almost too much. The drop to 1.5Hz is really noticeable and kind of rough. I know that Centerpointe's Holosync has these drops, too, as they recycle the "The Dive" track for every CD and combine it with different "Immersion" tracks (2.5Hz, 1.5Hz, .5Hz and .3Hz), but was it necessary to recreate that? I don't know. Maybe a ramp could have been incorporated in the second track, too.

    Oliver

  3. #13
    Ouroboros Guest

    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    I've always wondered about the drops myself. Sometimes they can seem kind of jarring. You could always edit the session to ramp instead of drop, to see how that goes.

    I think .5hz and .3hz are both in the sub-delta range.

  4. #14
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    I have in the meantime dropped the carrier pitch to 50Hz, and am right now loading 40Hz onto my MP3 player. This actually seems rather low, but to make sure everything was actually working right I tested it again with WAV files to make sure that the frequencies were actually playing and not being filtered out due to the MP3 encoding process.

    So far it has been interesting, but if DTZM is to be like Holosync, and Centerpointe's numerous claims were anywhere even remotely in the vicinity of being true, then I must wonder what some people really get out of the program... I mean it must take a LOT of time to get even close to these frequencies. And 20Hz is supposed to be the limit of average human hearing.

    I'm surely glad I did not invest that kind of money...

    Oliver

  5. #15
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    Centerpointe expects it to take 10 to 12 years as a minimum to complete their program.

    Frequencies below 20 Hz do function in binaurals. You just have to have the volume up higher the lower the frequencies go.

    Trying to stay awake directly makes you sleepy; try being "the witness" instead.

  6. #16
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom
    Centerpointe expects it to take 10 to 12 years as a minimum to complete their program.
    Now, that's a revenue stream...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom
    Trying to stay awake directly makes you sleepy; try being "the witness" instead.
    Actually, I watch my breath now and do not fall asleep nowadays. Which makes the claim of Holosync that it meditates for you or makes you meditate by itself somewhat silly, because I employ a meditation technique to not fall asleep while using it. It neither helps with becoming an observer nor with one-pointed focus, it just cycles me through trance states. I'm sure that's beneficial by itself, but meditation?

    I find it interesting that the "Hemisync Meditation" CD from the TMI Mindfood series produces a wholly different effect for me. It seems impossible to go to sleep with it, it keeps me alert. I just don't know what it actually does or is intended to do, it is a bit "underdocumented."

    Oliver

  7. #17
    Ouroboros Guest

    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    Hmm...I wonder if the Hemisync Meditation CD uses some beta frequencies layered in for alertness as well. Supposedly, you can't entrain to two different frequencies at the same time, but what little I remember reading about the frequencies that Hemisync uses, I think they actually do some layering like that.

    Of course, I could be totally off base as well.

  8. #18
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    I don't think you can entrain to two different frequencies at the same time, but some sessions alternate between frequencies and that seems to work, at least for some things.

    There's a downloadable session on the Transparent Corp site that has frequencies that alternate somewhat rapidly between 14Hz and 22Hz, for example. It's meant to have an awakening, uplifting effect (and it does). 14Hz is "normal" everyday awake brain frequency, and, of course, 22Hz is up in the higher Beta ranges. The session is good, and doesn't have the kind of anxiety attached to it that "pure" Beta can.

    Oh, just for the record, I also really recommend Gamma sessions for uplifting the spirits. Gamma waves are associated with compassion, with the feeling of unity with all things, with joy, with bliss, etc. Buddhist monks have higher incidence of Gamma waves all the time, and while in meditation (particularly lovingkindness meditation), they have much higher and broader bands of Gamma. I've been doing Gamma sessions for a while now, and I believe it has contributed directly to the awakening process I'm in, and certainly to thoughts of love for everything/everyone.
    May the light surround you, may you be blessed. May the light surround us, may we be blessed. May love and light surround us all, and may we all be healed and blessed. And so it is, and so it shall be, now and ever after.

  9. #19
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2

    I think I agree with Ouroboros here - Hemisync seems to do some layering.

    Actually, when reviewing DTZM and what was written about it in the forums there the author recommended to use a low-pass filter (cutting of all frequencies below a certain frequency) on the sound track (bowls and rain, etc) to avoid creating accidental monaural entrainment.

    Imagine having a carrier frequency of 180Hz (the default) and another sound that on both ears is some Hz above it. You would, I guess, get binaural entrainment from the difference between the both ears, but also some monaural entrainment from the difference between base frequency and the other sound. Maybe this effect is actually used by Hemisync?

    I'm thinking this is the case because I found this years ago:

    http://www.mind-gate.com/OBE/sound/7117.html

    This is in German, but what it does is this: For each Focus state it describes how many tracks you have to overlay, what the carrier frequency is and what the beat frequency.

    Focus 3
    59 [1.2] = r 59,6 + l 58,4
    110 [1.3] = r 110,65 + l 109,35
    288 [3.7] = r 289,15 + l 286,15

    So, for Focus 3 you need three tracks: 59Hz carrier, 110Hz carrier and 288Hz carrier. Now you overlay them with beat frequencies of 1.2Hz, 1.3Hz and 3.7Hz respectively, resulting in the listed frequencies for each ear respectively.

    I don't know why they do this (if they actually do this), but I've read before that people made tracks that overlaid different brainwaves - for example Gamma or Beta on relaxation sessions.

    Oliver

  10. #20
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    Re: Mind Stereo/Neuroprogrammer 2


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